Doing collaborative development of enzyme reagents applicable for detecting SARS-Cov2 (COVID-19)

Yamada: First, I’d like to ask the two of you about your areas of research. Professor Fujiwara, I recall that you were working together with Osaka Women's and Children's Hospital and Kyoto University to develop an enzyme reagent for detecting COVID-19.

Fujiwara: I conduct wide-ranging research with a focus on microorganisms, such as food microbes and pathogenic microbes, and my work also includes the development of enzymes for medical diagnostics. When I took an enzyme that I had analyzed about a decade ago and tested it on the novel coronavirus (SARS-Cov2), it worked perfectly. The enzyme was able to detect viral RNA within an hour with a high level of accuracy, and was deployed in the field for monitoring in Osaka Prefecture.

Saka: My area of expertise is accounting, and I conduct research on companies’ environmental measures, information disclosure, and corporate social responsibility (CSR). Recently, I have been conducting data analyses of relationships between companies' financial performance and the Sustainable Development Goals (SDGs) and with environmental, social and corporate governance (ESG). I have also started to deal with financial accounting big data, such as the financial data of all the listed companies in the world, and conducted exploratory data analysis through a supercomputer at the Information Technology Center of the University of Tokyo. To cite one example, it's fascinating to examine corporate value-added distribution ratios—which has recently become a popular topic—since this information shows us, on a global scale, how much these companies distribute to their employees in salaries, how much they pay in taxes, and how much of their profit they keep.

Yamada: I served at the Japan International Cooperation Agency (JICA) for 35 years, and I worked in their Afghanistan office before coming to Kwansei Gakuin University. At present, I am in charge of cross-School classes at the Center for International Education and Cooperation and an SDGs-related seminar, “Global Societal Issues and a Sustainable Future,” which began this spring.

Despite groundbreaking vaccine development, people lost their jobs

Yamada: Now, let’s get into the main topic. My personal opinion is that there is no need to go back to the way things were before COVID-19, and that we shouldn’t revert everything to the way they used to be. We are, in other words, seeking a world where our economic activities can be sustained while we limit the spread of infections, based on the premise of coexisting with COVID-19. I believe that we will overcome the virus when COVID has become endemic, and we are exploring how we will be able to live our lives when that moment comes.

Over roughly two years of the pandemic, our daily lives, and what we are conscious of, have changed in many ways. What are some of the positive and negative effects of the pandemic, and what problems have emerged?

Fujiwara: The development of RNA vaccines has been groundbreaking. The majority of researchers predicted that this technology would be made available for actual use in about a decade, but that timeline was accelerated immediately, due to measures taken against COVID-19. Speaking personally, I never thought I would have an opportunity to experience the dream method for vaccine development. Since RNA vaccines can be mass-produced at low cost, they should replace the vaccines used against many infectious bacteria and viruses in the near future, and by adjusting the amount of RNA in them, we can also deal with adverse reactions that are mentioned.

Going forward, manufacturing costs for vaccines should come down rapidly, even if we administer third and fourth shots. I feel that at the same time, other vaccines—such as the vaccine for influenza—will also be replaced by RNA vaccines.

Yamada: I had never heard that RNA vaccines were developed through innovative technology that did not exist until now. The disparity in access to vaccines between developed and developing countries has been brought into relief, and there are people around the world who cannot get vaccinated even though they want to, so I think it’s good that costs will come down. Professor Saka, what do you think from the business side of things?

Saka: This pandemic has accelerated changes to business models. In addition, online interaction has been introduced in a variety of areas as part of the new normal. We learned that while this situation is extremely convenient and comfortable for people with a certain level of work experience and a human network, it is incredibly difficult for young students trying to contact new people for their research and activities, and they struggle when everything is done online from the beginning.  I think a new kind of disparity has emerged in those areas, as well.

Being unable to conduct experiments has shifted science students’ awareness from “experimental” to “informational

Yamada: The impact of the spread of COVID-19 has not just damaged people’s health. It also hit the economy, creating a downturn which caused some people to lose their jobs. Professor Saka spoke about the effect of online classes on students. What about online science classes?

Fujiwara: We can easily share information even if students are far away, or located in foreign countries. This is a positive thing that I think we should continue to take advantage of, even after the pandemic.

On the other hand, in the experimental field, students need to learn how to use machines and reagents, and for about two years, they were mostly unable to acquire these skills. Students went on to their next year without sufficient experience with doing experiments, and since they were assigned to labs this academic year, there was a lot of confusion at the beginning of April. There is a huge difference between watching an online video to see how something is done, and actually doing it at least once. This “hollowing out” of skills acquisition is something that is happening all over the world.

Yamada: There are so many things in the science field that can only be obtained in an in-person setting. Two years is quite a long time. What effect has that had?

Fujiwara: Students' awareness in the biological sciences has shifted away from experiment-based research and toward information-based research by using a computer. That is because doing experiment-based research is a major time sink. The students themselves also realize that they will have a hard time in the research field because they do not have experience doing experiments, so laboratories doing information-based research were very popular this year.

Yamada: Professor Saka, how have students at the School of Business Administration responded to online classes, and what did they think of them?

Saka: It seems that for classes where students acquire knowledge, they feel that listening to lectures, reviewing them, and looking at materials are easier to do online, and such classes are effective. However, since actual business issues are complex and intertwined with many factors and stakeholders, it is difficult to solve them solely online, so I always conduct seminars face-to-face to share ideas and find solutions.

As a positive, the possibility of student-centered education has emerged

Yamada: There have been many different opinions about what universities should be amidst the pandemic, and what value they have.

Saka: In the United States, around 2014, people were already starting to say that universities were not providing value for money. Each university builds lavish facilities in order to win the competition among universities, and as a result, tuition fees rise. In order to pay those fees, students take on loans. In order to pay back those loans, graduates then join financial institutions which pay high salaries and chase short-term profits, which leads to economic instability. There is a limit to how far this can go.

Currently, universities like Minerva University, which utilize both online lectures and Project-Based Learning (PBL), have become popular. With the introduction of online courses, students are able to easily study overseas. When we considered the question of what value universities have amidst these circumstances, we thought that it is absolutely essential for students to develop four skills—critical thinking, creative thinking, presentation skills, and communication ability—which make it possible to solve issues, and these also form the core of Minerva University.

At the School of Business Administration, for the past three years, we have implemented PBL in our classes. It has been popular with students, and we can also see that they are experiencing growth. Going forward, it will be important for universities to utilize online learning effectively while simultaneously thinking about how to make real in-person classes worthwhile, and I am sure that will also increase value for Kwansei Gakuin University.

Yamada: It will be important for us to leverage the experience and knowledge we have gained over the two years we have faced COVID-19 by promoting measures such as online classes and flipped classroom learning. Setting aside the point of whether this is a good or bad thing, some students say that it is easier for them to participate and ask questions in online classes. There are some education professionals who say that we have entered an era in which students are choosing the alternatives that universities offer, and the possibility of student-centered education has emerged over the course of these two years dealing with COVID-19. That’s the upside. On the other hand, science students can't stay motivated if they’re unable to conduct experiments, and students in the humanities feel uneasy unless they are in contact with other students around them. As Professor Saka says, some things can only be done face-to-face. I think we should do hybrid learning, with face-to-face lessons to go along with online classes, considering the positive aspects of both sides.

The pandemic has caused faculty members to review their course content and led to improvement

Yamada: How do you look at the COVID-19 pandemic from the standpoint of the university's significance and value?

Fujiwara: By being conducted online, it becomes clear what classes are excellent and which ones are sloppy. I think that classes going online was a good opportunity for faculty members to check the quality of their own attitude toward education and the content of what they teach. The approach of the university, and how to provide our students with quality content, were called into question. I think that led to an improvement in class quality.

Yamada: I think it’s quite difficult for science students to keep their motivation up if they can’t do experiments. Did you notice any changes in the students?

Fujiwara: I mentioned that there was a trend for laboratories doing information-based research to be more popular than those doing experiment-based research during laboratory assignments, but there have also been cases of students choosing to work in a finance-related field or at a think tank, rather than at a manufacturer.  This is a phenomenon happening at schools of science and technology all over the world. Once again, we have been made to realize how to convey the fun and appeal of research and development is a major challenge for science education.

Yamada: Professor Saka, how do you think communication has changed, due to the shift to online?

Saka: Even in the business world, I feel that there are two completely opposite poles. There are those who view online communication negatively, and those who view it positively and treat it as an opportunity to meet as many people as possible to build up a network. For the latter group, a huge opportunity has come their way. I feel that there is no small number of students who are good at communicating online, rather than doing it face-to-face.

Since the start of in-person classes, students have been eager to study after a year stuck at home

Yamada: While they don’t really ask questions in class, it’s easier for students to ask questions remotely, without showing their faces. Setting aside whether or not that it’s really a good thing for society, there are many students who say that’s how they feel. Speaking generally, we have been able to see a state of affairs with parents working remotely and children studying at home, and perhaps this has been an opportunity to contemplate what things like “decent work” and “family” really are. Professor Fujiwara, how has COVID-19 affected your lifestyle?

Fujiwara: For myself, my lifestyle after COVID-19 hasn’t really changed from the way it was before. I think people imagine that faculty members in the sciences are always at the university, but there are people whose tendency to shut themselves away has grown even more pronounced. When it comes to students, last year’s first-year students were unable to come to school despite entering university, could not return home even if they wanted to, and lived away from home without being able to make friends. I think that being forced to go through such an experience for a whole year at such an impressionable age had a huge impact on them, and actually, since face-to-face classes began in their second year, they have been studying very hard. The seats at the front rows of the classrooms are filled up by students, and they ask a lot of questions. Their attitude is that they need to study hard and absorb everything.

People who aren’t reliant on a company are the ones who work most enthusiastically

Yamada: That’s one positive thing about the situation. Goal #8 of the SDGs promotes “decent work and economic growth,” and describes “decent work,” in this sense, as humane employment that is worthwhile. When I hear Professor Saka’s words and see the students, I get the sense that we have entered the age of decent work. What do you perceive as worthwhile and humane work?

Saka: People who work most enthusiastically aren’t reliant on a company. Even among students, the percentage of them who intend to work for a single company for a long time has declined. More capable people are leaving companies to go to venture businesses or found their own companies. In order to do that, they need to acquire professional skills. We were talking about the fact that science students are getting jobs in finance-related fields and consulting, but you could also say that’s due to students in the humanities and social sciences not having the prerequisite skills for a "data-driven society" (otherwise known as Society 5.0). They need to develop skills such as data analysis and math, as well.

Fujiwara: More and more, people with a core of technical skills are changing jobs. In the case of biological sciences, students need to develop into talented people with strengths as engineers which are second to none—for example, having expertise in organic synthesis or analytical chemistry. With some additional business sense and knowledge, such people are unbeatable. I want students to realize this, but I feel that faculty members are still not putting in enough effort on that front.

Yamada: Students shouldn’t think of the humanities and the sciences as separate things. They need to combine and utilize the strengths of the humanities and sciences, and leave university with a sufficient level of knowledge for being a member of society. However, in the case of science students, if they end up quitting in three or five years, then no results are produced.

Fujiwara: That’s exactly right. If you’re going to try and develop a usable technique, you need to work on it for about a decade. That’s one reason why people who work in the sciences don’t really move from one company to another. I think it’s because they enjoy doing research. Even among graduates, those students who joined the research divisions at manufacturers haven’t left their jobs. In a sense, research might be a selling point for them that doesn’t exist for humanities students.

Yamada: On the other hand, it’s relatively easy for humanities students to say that they will quit in three or five years. What is at the root of this difference?

Saka: I think that these days, companies might be becoming less able to offer the chances demanded by students. Companies are not aligned with the value systems of young people in some ways, and some of them feel that companies are too conservative and not keen on taking on new challenges in terms of their business operations and their working styles. I believe that this inability to change and the lack of innovation are major reasons why the economy has not been able to grow for the past 30 years in Japan. While Japan has so many long-lasting companies, which we are proud of, society will not be revitalized or undergo growth without healthy and innovative changes. The COVID-19 pandemic is also a great opportunity for companies to reframe their organizational culture in order to provide the job satisfaction desired by young people.

There are many KGU students with the drive to make the world a better place

Yamada: What should universities do to make that possible?

Saka: It is better for students to acquire the skills to collaborate, solve problems, and understand business models, but some of them just aren’t suited to thinking like bookkeepers. The important thing is developing their strong areas, instead of forcing them to work on their weak areas. Jobs are all about teamwork, so it would be ideal if students could analyze and solve complex issues collaboratively by making use of their respective strengths.

Yamada: When I look at Kwansei Gakuin University students, the spirit of Mastery for Service has been instilled in many of them, and they are calm and good at working with others. I have heard from corporate hiring managers that they want to employ KGU students because of their fine and upstanding character.

Saka: Before COVID-19, during break time on campus, you could hear the laughter of students here and there. The campus has a beautiful atmosphere, and that leads to the cheerful nature of KGU students. I think that there are also plenty of ambitious students at KGU who want to make their dreams into reality; not just to make money, but to fulfill people’s dreams and make the world better. They are also passionate about the SDGs.

Yamada: In the International Volunteer Program that I am in charge of, there is no need to explain the first part. The students want to serve others or take action in some way, and that's where they get started.

Fujiwara: Science students also have that same core mindset. Starting when they enter university, they become familiar with the spirit of Mastery for Service, and KGU also has Chapel Hour and other activities. I think that those are advantages for KGU students.

Stakeholders make appropriate decisions for building a good society

Yamada: I’d like to steer the conversation toward society after COVID-19. CO2 emissions decreased amidst the pandemic, as a result of economic activities becoming stagnant. However, when COVID-19 comes under control and economic activities resume, it is expected that CO2 emissions will gradually increase as well. What should the post-COVID world be like when it comes to the areas of business and industry?

Saka: As you said at the start, Professor Yamada, it’s important to avoid going back to the way things were. In my case, business trips went online, which has reduced the burden on my time and stamina, and I was able to do them without using unnecessary energy by taking transportation. I can use my time efficiently and have less of an impact on the environment.

In the business field, companies' purposes have been shifting from the previous mentality of “shareholder primacy” to a mindset of “stakeholder capitalism.” Stakeholder capitalism is a concept where companies grow by satisfying all of their stakeholders, working on creating shared value (CSV), and making society better. This is a vital movement which is also relevant to accomplishing the SDGs, and in order to make them a reality, appropriate decision-making by all of us individual stakeholders is necessary. I believe that it is important for all stakeholders to be aware of their responsibilities in creating a good society, so that companies which negatively affect the environment will not receive support and be removed from the market, while good companies will be valued.

The idea of transactions being “good for everyone” is important for companies

Yamada: That’s how the Omi merchants of old used to think. “Good for the seller, good for the buyer, and good for society.” Companies will not be chosen by investors or consumers without the idea of being “good for society.” They need to take this idea into account, and then consider what course they want to take. With regard to the SDGs, there have been disparities at the global level amidst the COVID-19 pandemic, and how we should respond has been called into question.

The concept of human security, which is related to the third SDG of “good health and well-being,” is important. Freedom from want and fear, which is something that cannot be addressed at the individual level, is the core concept for people who provide development support, and it is with this in mind that we must correct those disparities. Unfortunately, it has been said that work on the SDGs has been backsliding, due to COVID-19. What do you think about that, Professor Fujiwara?

Fujiwara: It has become possible for people to receive an equal education anywhere in the world, even for those in poor countries who were unable to be educated, as long as an online environment has been set up. There are various kinds of educational content being distributed, even on YouTube. Educational disparities are directly related to disparities later on in life, and I think it was a good thing that COVID-19 forced us to drastically change how things were in that area. Eventually, if organizations or institutions which grant students degrees upon reaching a certain level are recognized internationally, there may be people who earn degrees without going to university.

Even if we can return to the old status quo, we should specifically use what we learned from the pandemic to avoid doing so

Yamada: We have less than ten years before 2030, which is the target year for achieving the SDGs. In January of last year, UN Secretary-General António Guterres said that we need to take action without waiting. The key word is "ownership.” If we don't broaden our ideas to incorporate the Omi merchant concept of business being "good for society" as we tackle this challenge, I don't think it will go very well. What do you think we should do as individuals going forward, having learned from the COVID-19 pandemic, in order to build a better society?

Saka: The role that companies are expected to play in society today is becoming very large. If you took the GDP of countries and the sales of companies and put them in order, from highest to lowest, the American retailer Wal-Mart would be in 26th place after the GDP of countries such as the U.S., China, and Japan. From that point on, companies steadily grow in number on the list. They make up about 40 percent of the top 100 entries, and about 80 percent of the top 500 entries. Economically speaking, countries used to have the most power. However, these days, many developed countries face financial difficulties, and are unable to take effective action. On the other hand, corporate activities have come to have a great impact on our lives. At that time, I think we all need to be aware that our actions affect corporate activities. Which companies’ products will we buy? Which companies’ stocks will we invest in? Where will we work? It is important to be aware that each decision we make is us choosing a company, which, in turn, leads to the creation of a good society.

Yamada: I think that’s exactly right.

Saka: In order to make this a reality, each individual needs to know about corporate activities. In addition, I hope that people will learn about the past failures of society and companies by studying their history thoroughly. By doing so, we can also prevent possible failures caused by poor decision-making.

Fujiwara: I predict that we will be able to return to the pre-COVID status quo sometime around this summer. At that time, rather than completely throwing out all the areas of improvement and expanded possibilities that we learned about as a result of this experience, and reverting to how we did things before, it will be essential to fix and streamline how we do things. I learned that for research meetings and information sharing, in many situations, it's more effective to hold discussions online.

On the other hand, we need to bring back the old environment for doing experiments right away. In the first place, the laboratory buildings are generally equipped with a powerful ventilation system that allows fresh air to be cycled into rooms from the outside. Our regret that we should have brought back the old environment a little earlier. Saying that we can't go back to the way things were before, I feel that this leads to a naïve mindset that we can keep living these lives forever. I've realized how important it is for students to participate in university club activities and meet up with friends, as opportunities for them to communicate. I think we need to bring back that sort of precious time where we can.

An individual’s actions may not have much power, but they are not powerless

Yamada: First, we need to retain the lessons of living with COVID-19, and think about what to bring back and what to leave behind. I believe that we should leverage the possibilities that we have been able to see as a result of living with COVID-19, such as conducting large-scale classes online and offering high-quality classes, and aim to build a sustainable society by taking action which is different from what we did before COVID-19. When I tell my students to do this, they reply that they can't do much. However, although an individual’s actions may not have much power, they are not powerless. I try to push them by telling them that.

Fujiwara: For many experimental projects, the accumulation of data by many individuals will turn into valuable results. When the project succeeds, you will feel a sense of accomplishment and solidarity with your partners, just like a high school baseball team that reaches the national championship tournament. I hope that students will not forget this experience, and that they will be aware of the significance of each individual's efforts, even in activities other than research.

Saka: There is a saying in a certain book which means that a lone hero cannot change the world. It is up to each of us to make a difference.

Yamada: As you say, the Great Wall and the Pyramids were not built by lone heroes. They were built by ordinary people, who worked on them steadily for decades. The same is true for the society to come, and I would like to keep in mind that each of our small actions in the post-COVID era will lead to the creation of a better society.